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New-York tribune. (New York [N.Y.]) 1866-1924, October 05, 1912, Image 2

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Archbold before the commlttee. carry
U,e the Impllcatlon that the latter's
?trlbution of $100,000 was made fr.r
? purpose of currying favor improp
crly wlth the administration, as he in
terpreted lt, should be sufflclent to con
vlct both of them of tmproper conduct.
"Senator Penrose," he added, leaninq
forward in his chair. "ahould be thrown
out of tha S.nate on the admisaion he
haa made before thi* oommlttee."
CriticiseB thfl Committee,
Mr Roosevelt was allowed to express
wlthout lnterruptlon hls crltlclsms .f
rhe commlttee for not havlng afforded
hlm an opportunlty to reply lmmediate
ly to the Archbold charges regardlng
the J100.000 contrlbution of tbe Stand?
ard Oll Company instead of suspend
ing hearirigs untll a month later, and
inslsted that it had ahown untalrness
tn not Biunmonlng wltnesses to teetlfy
as U> the expendltures of the Republl- j
?an and Democratic partles.
"Mr IIVAvh and Mr. Bartholdt," sald j
the colonel clenchlng his teeth and I
tounding the arm of hlB chair. "have 1
BtatOd, according to the public prints,
that the Progresslves have spent J
.3,000,000 ln the prlmarlea. I Buggest j
Imt those gentlemen be brought lm
medlately before the commlttee and ]
requlred to mak.j good their statements. |
there i? no dtetlnctlon between the
eighth and nlnth Commandments, "Thou
sbalt rot steal' and "Thou shalt not
bear false witness agalnst thy nelgh
bor'; and one who breaks elther ls
ij-uiltj of Infamy. If what these gentle?
men have eald le not true, they should
be drlven from public life."
Colonel Roosovelt also lntdsted that
Charle* P. Taft. Charles R. Crane, of
Chlcago. and W. F. McCombs ahould
be called upon to testify. As to the
actual expendltureis during hls own pri?
mary campaign, however, he could
glvo little Informatlon, alleglng that I
he waa too buay to give any attention |
to that phase of the struggle. He ad- \
mltted that George W. Perkins and J
Frank A. Munsey had agreed to pay
Ihfl expenses of one of hls campalgnlng |
toufs, but sald they -were not called on
to provlde the money. as BUfflclent
' contrlbutions were recelved from other
1 Bources.
Escorted by 6everal of hls followers
Colonel Roosevelt arrlved at the 6en
: ate offlce buildlng ln a cheerful mood,
Bhowlng no 111 effects from the exer
tlons of hls long campalgnlng tour.
"During tho morning Bession he was
permltted to present his narratlve of
'the lncldents lnvolved ln the contro
versy under consideratlon without ln?
terruptlon. The examlnatlon did not
, jnperly begln untll the afternoon ses
_eiuiit but even then he recelved marked
deference, from the members of the
commlttee who questioned hlm.
Starts Off on Archbold Gift.
After Colonel Roosevelt had stated that
i he wfis a candidate for President ln 1904,
nnd that Mr. Cortelyou waa chairman
_and Mr. Bllsa treasurer of the natlpnal
commlttee that year, Benator Clapp aaked
lf hls attention had been called to certaln
statements by John D. Archbold.
?It has," replled Colonel Roosevelt,
Senator Clapp then aaked th* colonel
what he knew abatft the Archbold contrl?
bution at the tlme lt was sald to have
been made.
The colonel a?ked permtsslon to lnclude
*ln hls anewer the letter he sent to Chair?
man Clapp, already published, denylng
.that he knew of any Standard Oil contrl
'butlon to the 1S04 campaign at the tinje
U w aa made.
"in the flrst place, gentlemen." he went
on, "since I was elected Governor of New
York, that was about fourteen years ago,
I have wrltten and slgned about a hun?
dred thousand lettera, bo lt li not posslble
at one* to recall all the letters I have
wrltten on any given aubject.
"Iiooklng through my letter books *lnce
I wrote my recent letter to Senator Clapp. I
I have found two other letters bearing
on the aubject of campaign eontrlbutloo*.
One waa the letter to Cornellue tt. Bllsa,
a Forka
That is what the mami
facturer or wholesaler is do
ing when he is letting his
profits drip away in the form
of needlessly high overhead
Please jot down what you
pay every year for insurance,
cartage, porterage, Hght,
power, watchmen, and in
cid-ental services; and?
sharpen your pencil when
you do it.
i Send the figures to us?in confi?
dence?and ask us to match them
up with the corresponding charges
at Bush TerminaL
When you receive our reply,
you will wish to find out how soon
you can arrange to profit by the
advantages afforded at the Bush
Terrrdnal. T. ,,,
?This isn't gu# rswork. Tnats
how weVe brought nearlv two
hundred successful manufactur
ers over here.
Nearly two hundred successrul
manufacturers arrlved Inevitably
at the same condusion by the
. a_m< process of analysis. .
Write for our book on "Economy.
Bush Termlnal Co.
Oeneral Offlcos:
100 Broad Street, Now York aty.
-_ ?-_______________?_______?_?
182 West Flfty-Elghth SU
Ihe Finest
Resid e nt IjJ^ uj Win g
jn the World
One Sulte at .3,000.
One Suite at $5,000.
One Suite at $6,500.
CARPET i. t i. W. WIlilAKS
'P*>. Stf? < olu-ibu*. *_?!. 1S7G
CL.EANINC 353 West 54th St
ln IX*, whlch I understand waa recently
glven to your committee; the other a let?
ter written to George R. Sheldon in 191* ? "
Colonel Roosevelt turned to hls asslst
ants to aak for hla letter book. He finally
found the letter he souirht. and, atepj.lng
down from the witneaa chalr, handed lt to
Senator Clapp. who had lt placed ln the
record as an exhlhit. At the chairman's
requeat Colonel Rooaevelt read the letter.
dated Septrmter 21, 19uS. and addressed to
Oeorge R. Sheldon, treasurer of the Re?
publican Natlonal Committee. lt waa
practkally as follows:
I am Ir.formed that you. or some one on
behalf of tiie natlonal committee. has
oeen sollcltlng contributions from cor-1
poratlons. partlcularlv from John D. Arch?
bold and the Standard 011 Company. If'
thia Ib true, I wlsh to enter a vlgoroua
protest, and say that not only should such
contribution be refused, but that. If made. i
lt Bhould be lmmediately returned.
The letter set forth that "four yearfl
ago Mr. Cortelyou refuaed all contribu?
tions" from corporatlons whlch were be?
lng proaecuted or were likely to be prose
cuted. and that Colonel Roosevelt wlshad
the same courae followed ln the 190$ cam?
Ordered Money Returned.
Colonel Roosevelt read also the letter
of October 28, 1904, to Chalrman Oeorire
B. Cortelyou, ln whlch he dlrected thai lf
any money had been contrlbuted by the
Standard Oil Company or John D. Arch- :
bold lt should be returned at once.
Thls letter, he sald, had been referred
to and partly quoted ln hla recent letter
to Senator Clapp. It was an emphatlc
declaratlon to Mr. Cortelyou that "we
cannot under any oircumstanees afford
to take a contribution that mlght be con
strued aa placlng us under an obllga
ColoneJ Rooaevelt sald that on October
27, 1904. he had sent an "extra telegram"
to Chalrman Oeorge B Cortelyou. whlch
he had only recently found. It waa aent
from Oyater Bay and referred to hls let?
ter to Mr. Cortelyou demandlng return
of the Standard Oil contribution.
Colonel Roosevelt offered the committee
the orlglnale of all the letters he had
aent to Chalrman Clapp or had read Into
the record.
"We'U take your word for that," sald
Senator OUver, aa the colonel returned to
the wltness chalr and teatlfied that he
knew of no other letters bearlng on the
subject. and had practlcally forgotten
the Sheldon letter until he came across lt
aeaxchlo. hls fllea.
"Now ln regard to the Harriman
fund,' " began Senator Clapp.
Colonel Roosevelt lnterrupted and aaked
to explaln "the charges that hava been
made" ln regular order. and Senator Clapp
D?clarea Teatimony Hearaay.
"There ls no testlmony against me, ex
cefjt ln the form of hearsay evid*nce." the
colonel said, "hearsay atatements of men
thut are dead. Mr. Archbold and Mr.
Penroae purport to give statements of
what Mr. Bllss had to aay; Mr. Bllss ls
ilead. Mr. Ouell and the other gentlemen
refer to statements made by Mr. Harri?
man, who IB dead."
Colonel Roosevelt eald he had not ln?
tended to brlng hls former prlvate secre?
tary Into the controversy, but that aa the
committee had already determlncd to eall
Wllllam Loeb, Jr. he had asked hlm to
bear out hls atatementa.
"May I speak of a letter publlshed ln
?Hearst'a Magazine' from Congreaaman
Slbley?" asked the colonel, and then went
on: "It is a letter whlch ln substance
states that Slbley came to aee me and
speak to me about seelng Mr. Archbold.
nnd I aald I would be 'dellghted' to see
him and asked Mr. Slbley to brlng Mr.
Archbold to luncheon. I don't remem?
ber ever havlng talked to Mr, Slbley about
,,hat matter, but lt la very poaslble I may
have done so. Any Invltatlon that I may
h'ave extended was th* result of a requrst
hy Mr. Slbley. I always saw any men
l.rovjght to me by a Representattve or a
The colonel did not remember ever hav?
lng talked wlth Mr. Slbley about Mr.
Archbold. He aald Senator Bourne hnd
once brought Mr. Archbold to luncheon at
Oyster _ay.
Saw Everybody.
"Whlle I was President," he sald, speak
ing slowly and leaning forward, "lf any
man, trust magnate, soclallst, lawyer or
dergyman, had any buslness wlth me
and wanted to see me, I gladly saw hlm.
And If I thought there was anything to
be gained from the standpolnt of the
public service ln seelng any man, then.
without waltlng for hlm to ask, I would
send for him. If I am elected President a
year hence, lf Mr. Rockefeller or any one
else wanta to eee me 1*11 see hlm, anrl,
moreover, lf I have anything to ask for
the public service from Mr. Rocfcefeller.
J. P. Morgan or any one else 1*11 send
for Mm."
Colonel Roosevelt Instanced hls practice
of followlng that pollcy by saylng that
during hls administration he had sent
for Jamee Hlll, the railroad magnate.
"I thlnk I sent for J. Plerpont Morgan,"
said he; "at least T saw Mr. Morgan
ln regard to currency questlons. At thls
moment some of the same newspapers
that are carrylng commenta on the aup
posed faet that I sent for Mr. Archbold
are commentlng on the faet that I also
sent for a SoclallBt. Mr Brdere. to help
me draw up my platform. As to Mr.
Bruere they were rlght.
"If there ls any man from whom I think
I can get anything of value to the people
I wil! eend for hlm. I have sent for
trust magnates and prlze flghters. I have
aent for John U Sulllvan, 'Battllng' Nel?
son and Dr. Lyman Abbott," he added,
with a laugh that brought responee from
the crowd. "If ever I find my vlrtue ls so
frail lt won't stand belng brought ln con
tact with truat magnates. labor leadera,
or any one elee, 1*11 get out of public Ilfe."
"Did you say you sent for John I.. Sul?
llvan?" asked Senator Paynter. wlth a
smlle." "I thought he waa a haa been. and j
I dld not know you were ln that class." (
"Well, as to Sulllvan and Nelson, I
____ they came to aee me." Roosevelt |
Bald. "Sulllvan waa a big man and a good
man. I thlnk they caune to see me them
selves on aome queatlona of great publlo
Here a burst of laughter rang out.
"Of courae, there. may have been some
personal lntereat in lt," he added, laugh
Taka* Up "Harriman BusinaBS."
? Now. about the Harriman buslness,"
said the colonel. "I feel that there ought
not to be need for any lntelllgent man
to ask any questkm aft.*r readlng the let
ters I wrote at that time." .
Colonel Roosevelt took up hls letters |
to Mr. Harriman and defended the use of
the term "practical men" ln the much- J
Hacuased letter of October 14. 1906. He
Bald hlB effort was to get practical men
into polltica.
"When the use of the word 'practical'
Is tfljtan to Indlcata some improper mo?
tlve on the part of the us*r. then I thlnk
there ls some moral weaknras ln the man
nrhr* makes the acciisation," declared the
colonel emphatlcally. Then he read the t
etter and declared that lt "was absolutely 1
ncompatible wlth a sugKeatlon of my get- 1
ilng ald from Mr. Harriman ln any way."
On October 20, 1904, Colonel Roosevelt
-ald, Mr. Harriman had tHephoned to
S.cretary Loeb, who tokl the President
Mr Harriman wanted to see hlm about
tbe New York State campaign. whlch waa |
?runnlng badly." The colonel aald he
made the appointment through Seeretary
Loeb at Harriman's reque?t.
?Mr. Loeb was pres.-nt throughout al?
most all of that lntervlew." he went on.
"There was no posslbillty of any mtsun
iWstandlng. I mentlon that because 1
have seen that some well meaning but
flabby persons have sald there mlsht
have been a mlsundr-rstandlng between
Mr Harrlman and myself."
Colonel Kooaevelt sald that at the tlme
the Harrlman contrlbution wa* made
there was no doubt of the national tlcket
cnrrylng New York, but that the state
tteket waa ln dlfflcultlea.
"There waa not one word spoken by
Mr. Hsrrlman or me," sald the colonel. |
"havlng any reference to the collertlon
o? funda for tlu- national campaign. On
the contrary. the entlre converaatlon was
to the effect tbat the national campal?n
was safe and that ald should be Riven
to the state campaign."
Colonel Roosevelt sald he had aubse
quently had a talk wlth Mr. Harrlman.
who favored the appolntment of ex-8enn
tor Depew aa Ambassador to Franee, but
he told Mr. Harriman that other tlnan
cial men were aupportlng James H. Hyde,
av6 Mr. Harrlman began to oaca water
The colonel added that he made lt clear
that Mr. Hyde waa too young for the lm
portant dlplomatlc po*t and had not "won
fil* spura."
Fcr th* State Campaign.
* I wlah to call your attention to the
fact that Judge Duell and Mr. Sheldon
both have testlfled, and that Mr. Bliss
Htatcd, that tho money waa not ralaed by
Mr. Harriman for the national campaign,
but that lt was ralsed by Mr. Bllas to help
out Mr. Harrlman ln the state campaign.'
nald the wltnesa. "Mr. Loeb waa present
during the lntervlew between Mr. Harri?
man and myself and heard every word
"Mr. Harrlman askid me to get Mr
Cortelyou and Mr. Bliss to help ralse
funds for the New York State campnlsn
I never asked Mr. Harrlman, dlrectly or
IndJrectly, for a dollar to help ln that
campaign or any other."
Colonel Roosevelt then aald he wished
to correct hls statement regardlng hls
lntervlew wlth Harriman
"Mr. Harriman told me." he said, "the
national commlttee people had plenty of
rnoney, and I told hlm I knew nothlng
-bout that. Hls "request to me was that
l aak the national commlttee to give
money, not that I aak the national com?
mlttee to help raiae money. He said the
national commlttee already had plenty
if funds."
Colonel Roosevelt then dlscussed Judge
Alton B. Parker'a statement ln K<*l and
declared that "a repeated mlastatement'
rharged to hlm was that he had sald
rorporatlon* did not contrlbute to hls
V.W campaign.
"I never made the statement that cor?
poration* had not contrlbuted to the Re?
publican party." he sald, emphaflcally.
He aald hls recent letter to Chairman
Clapp and hls "open published state?
ment" made lt clear that he had never
flrrtlcd that eon>oratlons had contrlbuted;
but denled speclflcally that corporations
had been "blackrnalled" lnto contrlbut
Ing "or assured of aome klnd of favor"
for contrlbutlng.
Colonel Roosevelt eald he had securod
the word of Bllsa apd Cortelyou that the
statement wa* a fact before he made It.
Corporation contrlbutlona were not con
aldered Improper ln 1904. 13O0 or 1S94, he
sald, and It was public knowledge that
lh?-y were betnir made.
Aftflr Archbold _nd Penroae.
For an hour the colonel had talked.
practlcally wlthout Interruption. Haif a
1ozen questlons by Senator Clapp Marted
hlm, and thereafter there waa no oppor
tunlty for queatlons. Colonel Roosevelt
talked along, chooalnjr hla own aubjects,
gtopplng now and then to go through hls
papers or to confer with Mr. Ixieb. nnd
cccaalonally tuming to the commlttee
wlth an earneat "Ia that qulte clear."' He
?jestlculated freely when he declared that
-orporatlons had contrlbuted to both Deni
scratlc and Republican funds lri 1601.
"Now. 1 wlsh to take up the testimony
Df Mr. Archbold and Senator Penro**,"
?ald Colonel Roosevelt. He paused to
look at some memoranda, and an air of
expectaney settled over the room.
"I wlsh," he continued, "to call your at?
tention to thls fact ln connectlon wlth the
itatements of Mr. Archbold, as In the case
cf Mr. Harrlman. Each tegtlfltd he got no
Improper conslderatlon from the adminis?
tration. Mr. Archbold and Mr. Hairiman
jlike complaln, not that the administration
flld what it ought not to have done, but
that the administration refused to do
what lt ought not to do. Mr. Archbold
?nd Mr. Harriman'a complalnt la that
they got nothlng from the admlnlatratlon.
"Mr. Archbold testlfled that Cornellus
tf, Bliss. who Is dead, attemptod to black
mall hlm and that I knew of It. I tl^n't
for a minute believe Mr. Bllsa trk-d to
blackmall hlm; lf he did I knew nothlng
of It, and I had the aasuranc* of Mr.
Cortelyou over the telephone agaln yes?
terday that such a contrlbution waa not
"I want to call your attention to the
testimony of Messrs. Archbold and P..*n
rose agalnst themselves. Mr. Penrose
testlfled that he, advl*e<l Mr. Archbold to
have the Btnndnrd Oll Company subnilt
to the blackmall, and that he did lt to
prevent bSBBf subjected to hostlllty fnin
certaln sources. They could mean hostll?
lty only from myself, the Attorney Gen
ural or the Commlssloner of Corporations.
"They could Incur my hostlllty only lf
they vlolated Ihe law. I had no way of
Siffng hostlle unless they vlolated the law.
So th? action of Penrose ln advlalng
Standard Oll to make that contrlbution
waa advlce to lt to protoct Itself a-talnst
proaecutlon for vlolatlon of the law.
"When I waa Pnllce Commlssloner of
New York Clty," exclalmed the colonel,
had a member of the police force done
ln connectlon wlth the enforcement of
the law agalnst llquor aelllng what Mr.
Penrose says he did in thla case I would
have thrown hlm off the force."
WentB Penroflfl Thrown Out.
The colonel lean*d forward In hla chair,
?hook hls flst at th* commlttee and
?mputed: "And T hold that the Senate of
:he United States ahould throw Mr. Pun
ro*e out of the Senate for the admlsalom
ne made before thls commlttee
"Now, aa to Mr. Archbold," rc.umed the
?olonel. "he testlliea he made thls con
ributlon and expected some unusual klnd
?f compenaatlon. He says Mr Penrose
ried to blackmall hlm. yet he see* noth
ng wreng ln what Mr. Bllsa did. He seea
lothlng Improper ln attempting to extort
contrlbution from hlm. Hla complalnt
s that nothliiK Improper was done for
Witness rcferred to Arehbo'.d'a state
rient that the Roosevelt admlnlstr.itlon's
reatment of the Standard Otl Company
Ivall.-d "darkest Abysslnla."
"It ls true that when I was President I
dmlnlstered the darkeat Abysslnlan
reatment' to the Standard Oll Company,"
IS went on, "but it was because lt needed
t If I um President agaln I will aga'n
dmlnisttr lt to any corporation of the
Itandard Oll type that may need It."
The ..olonel added that a strengthentng
f the antl-truat law waa needed.
Senator Pomerene aaked Colonel Rooae
veit to "suspend for a moment" at that
polnt and the colonel mlsunderstood hlm
and half rose from hls chalr.
"Oh, 1 thought you asked me to stand a
mlnute." he said. laughlng.
A recess of several mlnutes, gave the
colonel an opportunity to move from the
wltness stand He leaned over the com?
mittee table to talk to Chalrman Clapp
and then took a few steps about the room.
Flnnlly he went back to the stnnd.
Couldn't Ba "Catlad Off."
?The next statement that I want to eall
vour attentlon to," sald the colonel, "ls
that of Mr. Archbold that when the Bu?
reau of Corporatlons began Its Investlga
tlon of the Standard 011 Mr. Archbold
went to Mr. Bllss to eall me off. He tes
tlfles that Mr. Bllss toM hlm: "J have no
lnfluence wlth Mr. Roosevelt; I cannot j
help you.' That statement le only partly ,
true, for Mr. Bllss dld have great ln- j
flur-nce wlth me. I had a great respect
for Mr. Bllss. But Jt ls true that nelther
Mr. Bllss nor any other human l*elr.g had
tbfl Fllghtest lnfluence wlth me so far as |
gettlng me to refraln frorn prosecutlng
any corporatlon for breaking th* law. All
these men who'testify against me testify
that I refured to do. or dld not do, any?
thing Improper in thelr intereata. And
they are all now supporting tho eandl?
dates airalnst me?those who are allve."
Roosevelt sald he had a flfcht wlth the
Standard Oil Company ln 1903. when he
8-fl gettlng through the Bureau of Corpor?
atlons Wll. addlng: "Senator Clapp, you
were ln the flght. and so were you, Sen?
ator Paynter. I belleve."
He finally got the blll through, he said
by publishlng telegrama aent by tne
??younger Mr. Rockefeller."
"1 nad my flrst bruah with the Stand?
ard Oil Company then." he sald, "and
they knew Just what they could expect
from me."
Colonel Roosevelt emphaslzed his state?
ment wlth blows of his hand on the
wltness chalr.
"I wlsh to eall your attentlon to thia
faet ln connectlon wlth Mr. J. P. Mor
gan'a testlmony yesterday." he contlnued.
? It waa in my flrst administration that
the Northern Securitlea case was settled
with a verdlet against Mr. Morgan and
James J. Hlll. It waa also during my
flrst administration that I settled the
anthraclte coal strike. I have understood
that Mr. Morgan expressed vlgorously hla
(lissatlsfaction wlth my attltude ln that
case. and I waj surprlsed to find that he
had contrlbuted to my campaign fund.
No one connected wlth Mr. Morgan ever
hinted that the contribution had B*s_fl
mnde, and no one over hinted to me that i
any fav..r should be ahown to Mr. Morgan
for any reason whntevor."
Colonel Roosevelt sald he flrst hflflflf. of
Mr. Morgan's contribution ln the testl?
mony yesterday. and he then paid a trib
uto to tb* late Cornelius N. BUbb.
Colonel Roosevelt Inslsted that during
the 1904 campaign Mr. Bllss had afaured
hlm that no promlaea. "express or lm
pllid," had jBBW made In r<*turn for con
trlbutlons. and that Mr Bllsa had never
asked hlm after hls electlon for any
favora fnr contrlbutors.
Takee Up This Year'a Campaign.
Colonel Roosevelt asked to make a
further statement regardlng hla campaign
thls year, und sald.
"I Baw the dlfferent men who were In
tereate.1 ln my campaign at Chlcago nnd
before Chlcago, and explalned expllcltly
that I would tolerate- no effort of any
klnd, by the uae of m"ney or the offer of
patronage, to get delegates for me.
"The only time I ever aaw lt rharged
waa ln reference to Omisby McHarg. I
wrote a letter to hlm and got an answer,
whlch I have her*"
Colonel Rooeevelt'a letter waa written
March 4, 1912, and aaked Mr McHarg
"for hls personal aasurance" that ha had
gjaxtat uaed money or other lnfluence to
secure hlm delegates. ?'
Mr McHarg. reply read ln part:
I unhesl'tattnglv say th.it no reputable
man <an say that I ever endeavored by
tt.e use of money or tha proinlso of
patrona_a to aid your campain 1 aiaa
to uncqulvocally deny that charge I
know that you would lmmediately repu
<J:hi> ine lf I dld make any auch effort.
Colonel Rooaevelt took up tbe allega
t!on that J3,OCK',000 waB used in the Pro?
gressive primary campaign.
".Mr. Hllles and Congreaaman Hartholdt
have made thls statement," he sald. "1
auggeat very strongly that both those
men be called here lmmediately nnd asked
to produce thelr proof Tho man who
bears false wltness la guilty of as ln
faiBOi?I condiict aa the man who steuls
If Mr Bartholdt or Mr. Hllles enn prove
thelr atatementa they ought to be com
pelb-d to do so If they cannot, they
ought to be drlven out of public nfe,"
Wants Othar Funda Takan Up.
Colonel RoosBvelt'a volce changed sllght
ly as he went on:
"I want to eall your attentlon to th*
faet, gentlemen. that, however unwlt
tlngly, the men you have called beforo
you thus far have all been called to tea
tlfy to contrtbutioofl to ray funda. I
r'-allze that I have to make way agalnat
both of the old partlas, but I reapectfully
Buggest that you eall aome men who know
about the expensea of other eandldates."
BanalOB I'aynter stnted that Chalrman
ClapP had made the arrangarnenta for
the committee and that no effort had been
made to treat "unfalrly" .the Roosevelt
"Our complalnt ls not that we were
called here." Interrupted Colonel Rooso
velt, "but the men who make the charges
were not called flrat."
Colonel Roosevelt dernandod that
Charlea P. Taft. Wllllam B. McKinley
and also Chalrman McCombs and Vlce
Chnlrman McAdoo of the Democratlc
committee be aummoned.
"Vou can see lt la hard na me." aald
the colonel, "to have to walt a month to
anawer Mr. Archbold'e charges and then
to have thlnga ao arranged tbat the att?wi
tlon of the country la rtveteA on the cam?
paign expensea of th* Progreeslve party
whlle no attentlon IB dlrected to th* cam?
paign funds of the other eandldates."
I aasure you that If the committee
llves, tho othar men wlll be brought here
before electlon," aald Chalrman Clapp.
At thls polnt the committee took a re?
cess until 1:80 o'clock.
Never Knew Until Now.
Colonel Roosevelt resurned the stand
when th* committee reconvened, and Sen?
ator Paynter took up hls examlnatlon.
The colonel relterated that hls flrst
knowledge of DOO.OOO contrlbutlona ln 1904
by J. P. Morgan or Oeorge J. Oould came
from the teatlmony of Oeorg* R. Sheldon
"I knew H". C FYlck had contrlbuted
heavily and was ready to contrlbute
more," he sald. "I dld not know the
amount. Mr Knox had told me that Mr.
Frlck was one of my strongtst backers.
"I had heard there was a Standard Oil
contribution, but I dld not know that lt
came from Mr. Archbold."
He could not remember who told hlm,
he sald.
Senator Paynter called attentlon to
Colonel RooBeveU'a telegram of October
27. 1904. to Mr. Cortelyou, asking that the
Standard OH contribution be returned
? 'without delay."
"Did you understand there had been
a dslay?" asked 8enator Paynter.
"I couldn't get any raply to-my lat
tflrfl," said Colonel Roosevelt. "Mr.
Cortelyou wbb out Wflflt, I thlnk. I
thought tha money would be rflturped,
but I wanted to makfl It clear that in
my mlnd there waa no doubt that the
contrlbution should b* retgrred."
"Have you believ?d ati thesa years
that the Standard Oil contribution wbb
not mad??" asked Senator Payntflr.
"Corteiyou told ma that, and Mr. Bliaa
told Mr. Loeb that, and only tha other
day Mr. Cortelyou told me that he had
been informed by Mr. Bliaa that no
contribution had been made by tha
Standard Oil Company.
"I had an expllclt underslandlng wlth
Mr. Bllas and Mr Cortelyou that ho
money waa to be accepted lf any klnd of
condltlon were expreaaed or Implled as to
Its receipt, and that no money waa to be
spent In any improper way, such aa the
buylng of votes.
Two Contributiona Sent Back.
"Mr. Cortelyou told me of two lnstances
of hls rebirnlng contrlbutlons. One of
these was from a gentleman who. after
maklng a large contrlbution, mentlonod
that he would llke to be candidate for
Mlnister to Belglum. Mr. Cortelyou re?
turned hla money. The other waa tn the
case of the tobacco trust and the lnde
pendent tobacco dealera. Both these con
Irlbutlona were refuaed."
There was no rule llmltlng the amount
of a contrlbution, sald the colonel.
Senator Paynter aaked what Colonel
Roosevelt meant by saylng no money waa
to be accepted wlth a condltlon "ImpllecL"
The colonel hesltated a moment and
sald: "Such a condltlon a* Mr. Archbold
Indleated." He ev.plalned that he consld
i-r-d Mr. AfOhbflid'i statements Indleated
an "lmpllcatlon" of some understandlng.
"That tioo.000 from Mr. Morgan prob?
ably meant leas tr hlm that the $20 I re?
celved from the iady who was a book
keeper ln Cleveland, or the $1 from the
widow or a veteran ln a soldlera' home,"
explalned the colonel.
Senator Paynter aaked the meantng of
m H. Harrlman's letter of June 2, 1904.
In whlch Mr. Harrlman sald he waa try?
lng to see "Dodge. Hughltt and Ftlck."
The colonel sald Marvln Hughltt had
agreed wlth hla vlews on rate legisia?
tion. and thnt when any one diflfered wlth
hlm as to rallroad leglalatlor. he eent
them to Mr. Hughltt, who could explaln
"my posltlon from the vlewpolnt 0- a
practbal rallroad man."
Hsrrlman a Good Frland.
The witness sald he and Mr. Harrlman
were very good frlends.
IflSJatOf Paynter wanted to know about
the Invltation to Harriman to dlne at the
White House.
"Oh, I wrote hlm several tlmefl lnvltlng
hlm to call," sald the coloneL
Senator Paynter then read Colonel
Roosevelt's series of letters pressing Har?
rlman to vlslt the White House.
Colonel Roosevelt sald he "did not
know" and "could not remember" the clr
uumstancea of many of the Harrlman let?
ters put ln the record by C. C. TegethofT.
Colonel Roosevelt's examlnatlon so far
had proceeded slowly and quietly, to the
surprlse of those who had expected
rla<hes and heated retorts. The colonel
was dellberate, ar.d ln no hurry to an
awer, though he replled wlth every evl?
dence of wllltngr.eaa.
Senator Paynter trled to get Colonel
Roosevelt to aay that Mr. Harrtman'a
vlslt ln response to a telegram ln Octo?
ber. 1604, waa a result of the Prestdent's
"carnest sollcltatlon." but the colonel in
?lst-d Harriman had been raleased from
any oblUatlon to corae to th* Whtte
House by the "rractlcal m*n" Utter, -and
that the vlslt was prompted aoleiy by the
New York State altuatlon.
Senator Paynter waa Inalstent, and
flnally Colonel Rooaevalt exolatmed, wlth
_ trace of lmpatlence: "Why, Senator
Paynter, he waan't under any obllgatlon
to come. He could come or not, Juat aa
he wanted to."
"He had an Invltation to come under
those clrcumatancea?" aaked Benator
"He or any one elae could come or not
r-ome, under any clrcurnstances," retorted
the colonel.
New York Cempalgn.
Colonel Roosevelt dlacussed the Hlgglna
i-ampalgn for Governor In New York.
"Mr. Hl??lna was supposed to be," he
aald, "merely an Instrument of Mr. Odell.
Mr. Odell waa very close to Mr. Harrl?
man. A bltter campaign waa wnged
tSJeteet Mr. HlKgln*, and Harrlman ho
L-ame favorably Interested. aa a matter of
personal prlde."
Colonel Roosevelt admltted that ald
fflven to the Republican stat* tlcket ln
i!*M would have helped hlm.
"But that was not the tdea," he add*d.
"They all knew I waa safa, and they
were trylng to develop atrength for Hlg?
glna. If you'U look at the bettlng at that
llmo on me and on IMggine you'll fle? how
uiattors *tood."
Senator Pomerene then took up Colonel
Roosevelt'a examlnatlon, and to hlm the
:o'.onel sald he had asked Ellhu Root, W.
Murray Crane and thfl elder Bliss to take
the chalrmanshlp of the Republican Na?
tional Commlttee and they had decllned.
"Was there ever anythlng to Indicate to
^ou that Mr. Cortelyou and Mr. Bllas did
tiot keep each other Informed aa to their
ndlvldual work ln the campaign?" asked
3enator Pomerene.
"Not that I know of," aald the colonel.
"Did you at any tlme furnlah a llat
if names of posslble cuntrtbutors to th*
:ampalgn managera?"
"Not as far aa my meraory goea. I
would have remembered lt." sgld the
Never Asked Flnanciflr to Help.
Colonel Rooaevelt aald he never wrote
i letter to any nnancler asklng hlna to
sollclt funds. He sald he had never au
:horl_*d any one to collect funda, except
*>y the general authorltatlon given to Mr.
Senator Pomerere asked Mr. Roosevelt
whether he had corresponded wlth "any
jne In Chlcago" relSttve to the collectlon
sf funds ln 1904.
"Not that I know of," waa the answ.r.
Of hla letter dlrectlng a r.turn of the
3tandard Oll contrlbution the colonel
"The only aecusatlbn spe.lnVally made
ihout the receipt of money concerned the
Standard Oll Company, and that was the
nnly one I conBldered tt necessary to
Senator Pomerene polnted out that Mr.
-ortelyou, aa Seeretary of Cornmerce and
Labor, had general supervlslon of the
Bureau of Corporations prior to hls be
?omlnu chairman of the national commit
ee, and asked lf Judge Parker's charges
,vere not general allcgations aa to the
indesirahillty of placlng the aupervlslng
lead of tha Bureau of Corporations In a
;n;sltlon to collect funds from corpora
"Yes. tlie charge was largely by In
luendo," replled the colonel, "and I dts
Jke a charge of that klnd more than I
lo a dlrect charge. I llke a man to be
Steel Corporation'a Contrlbution.
Senator Pomerene aaked about the con
rlbutlon of the Steel Corporation, and
:olonol Roosevelt aald that he knew only
of the contribution of H. C. Frlck. He dld
not know. he aald, of the contribution of
J. P. Morgan, unleas that $150,000 repre
sented t-lso the contribution of Morgan's
"If the contrlbutora include Mr. Frlck."
he went on, "I probably knew In a gen?
eral way that lt had been made, becauae
I knew Frlck had contrlbuted. Mr. Frlck
knew of my demand that the Standard
011 contribution be returned, and he sald
that lf that meant a loss to my campaign
he would contiibute more, although he
had already given to the fund."
Colonel Roosevelt sald he knew nothing
about contrlbutlona by Ilfe Insurance
"Dld you know how much waa contrlb?
uted by the beef Intereata?"
"I knew nothing about lt. Thia ia the
flrst auggestlon I ever heard about thelr
contributing. I had already moved
, against the beef trust, and I don't be
lieve they contrlbuted. I supposed they
were agalnat us," anawered the colonel.
"You say you moved against the Stand?
ard Oil Company before the 1904 cam
[ palgn. Why do you suppose they changed
tl.dr attitude and contrlbuted?" asked
| Senator Pomerene,
"I have no means of knowlng," sald
{ the colonel
Colonel Roosevelt sald he knew nothing
of contributions by railroads; that Mr
Cortelyou had Informed hlm no funds
I had been accepted from the tobacco Ln
I terests. He aald he had no conversatlon
! with elther bilss or Cortelyou aa to
"trust contributions," beyond telllng
them that none should be accepted when
offered wlth the expectation of favor.
| Senator Tomerene asked lf lt would not
be natural for corporatlons whlch con?
trlbuted ln 1904 to expect favors.
"It's lmposslhle for me to say that any
man who glves a dollar does not expect
a return for that dollar," sald Colonel
Roosevelt, "but when I tell hlm ho will
get no return I can prevent hls expect
lng lt"
Colonel Wlns Applause.
"Aa a practical man. colonel," sald
Senator Pomerene, 'don't you belleve
that at least some of the big contrib
utors expected returna?"
The colonel grasped the arms of hla
chalr and half rose as he replied:
"Speaking aa a practical man of hlgh
ideala, who has trisd to put these ideals
into practice, I believs that when I tell
a man he will recalve no return, if ha
than intiata upon giving and expeoting
a return, he (a either a orook or.a fool."
A wave of applause swept the commit?
tee room and Chalrman Clapp banged hls
Senator Pomerene asked lf the ao-called
coal trust had contrlbuted.
"My dear sir," returned Colonel Rooae?
velt, "after the revelatlona that have
been made here I wouldn't be surprlsed
at any one havlng contrlbuted."
He sald no report was made to hlm aa
to the recelpta or the contrlbutors.
"I think Mr. Blisa would have resented
an lnqulry from me aa to the contrlb?
utors," he added:
"You made no lnqulry of hlm or Mr.
"No, none."
"Were you ever advlsed aa to the pro
portlon of the campaign funds of 1904
contrlbuted by corporatlonfl?"
"No, never. I never heard It dlB
cussed," sald Colonel Rooaevelt "I
never made any lnqulrlea. I dldn't even
know the contrlbutora ln thls campaign
until Mr. Hooker publlahed them before
thia committee. I've had a fatrly stren
uous Ilfe In thia campaign on my part."
Harka Back to 8tandard Oil.
"Colonel.. tt haa appeared haro ln tha
testlmony that tha JlOfctWO contrlbuted by
the Standard Oil Company was not re?
turned." began Sebator "Pomerene.
"Well, doea that appear aa a faet?" in
terrupted Roosevelt.
"Yea, there is evidance to that ef?
fect," flaid Mr. Pomarane.
Ml want you to notBi" Colonel Roosa
valt vontur*od, "that I have npver said
aithtr that I did or did not bslievo it
waa made. Until Mr. Archbold taatifiad
I had never heard that the 8tandard
Oil Company or Mr. Archbold had mada
a contribution. I had heard that Rog
ara had made one; I haard it a yaar or
two after tha campaign, but I undar
atood Blisa did not claas him a Stand
ard Oil raprasantativa, because he had
other large intereats. I know nothing
about tha Archbold contribution."
"What evldence dld you have that the
Standard Oil contribution was not made?"
"Mr. Bllss informed Mr. Loeb it had not
been made." anawered Colonel Rooaevelt.
"Mx. Cortelyou Informed me that Mr.
Bllss had told him lt had not been made."
"Do you know who contrlbuted the J2G0,
C00 fund ralsed by Mr. Harriman?"
"I don't know. I see Mr. Morgan sald
yesterday he contrlbuted to lt. Remem?
ber, I don't know that such a fund waa
ever ralsed."
"Was there any reaaon why Mr. Cor?
telyou ahould not hava full knowledge of
whether the- $100,000 Standard Oil con
trlbutlen was returned?" asked Senator
"None that I know."
Colonel Rooaevelt aald that ln reply to
hla lettera demandlng the return of the
Standard Oil Bubscrlption Cortelyou and
Bllss telephoned to Loeb, and Cortelyou
came to Washington and assured hlm no
such contribution had been received.
No Knowledge of Conference.
Colonel Roosevelt sald he had no knowl?
edge of any "conference of big flnanclal
lr.tereats ln New York to devlsa ways
and meana to support the Republican
candldatea." He knew nothing of tha ap
polntment of a secret "advlaory com?
mittee" ln 1904 or whether Mr. Fresch
had been asked by Mr. Cortelyou to
serve on such a committee.
"Fresch. of New York?" repee.ted the
colonel, trylng to recall hls name. "I
know so many Fresch men I feel aa lf I
muat aak lf I know the man."
So he Jurned to Mr. Ijoab. who sald Mr.
Fresch waa ln the sulpbur buslness.
"You sea," lnterrupted tha colonel. "lt
may be aome one who has sald to ma, 'I
am the man who waved tha flag when
you came into the statlon,' or somethlng
of that klnd."
"Thls ona eeemsd to be extremely anx
lous to wave your flag, for he contrlbuted
J10.000 to your pre-eonventlon campaign,"
remarked Senator Pomerene.
"Then I aball make hla acqualntance at
once," Bald Colonel Roosevelt, Wlth en
Benator Paynter aald lt had been a_*>
gested that Mr. Fresch was at one t\m
ccnneoted wlth the Standard Oll Cce*>
Colonel Roosevfllt leaned back ln hls
chair, laughed and exclalmed: "My dear
Senator, If any one connected wlth the
Standard Oil Company ls contributtng to
me now he Is dolng so at hia own perfl.
I don't feel obllged to warn hlm. Do you
thlnk from Mr. Archbold'* testimony ha
was ln favor of me?"
Thls called out loud laughter.
Doesn't Know Thi. Year's Expsnsfl*
Colonel Roc^evelt sald he could give th*
commlttee no Informatlon of the expen
ditures of his managers ln thls year's
primary campaign.
"It has been suggested that a larg*
aum of money was undorwrltten to he
spent ln the campaign. What do you
know about that?" he was aak*.
__^LT____! Mld thcr* w*' "'bflonitelr
ae BM arrangement. but on one occaslon
the expense of a .peclal traln for ,W
was underwrttten by Mr. **_**?. and
Colonel Roosevelt declared that *i ___
Ht_,nhtheCamPaUn' ^-^ur.
Hooker brought hlm a cllpplng ot a __W
paper article to the effect that ??
had been ralse.l for the Roosevelt funT
t^ere wasnerin the Progressive treaV
The colonel sald he had no further In?
formatlon, and was excused. He then
went to the National Muaeum to .*? hla
Afrlcan trophlea.
Mr. Loeb Called.
Wllllam Loeb, Jr., formerly Mr. Roose
velt'B prlvate seeretary, was called to
testlfy before the colonel left the stand,
and stood, a deserted figure, walttng for
the oath to be admlnlstered whlle thj
commlttee and spectators sald goodby ta
Mr. Loeb subetantfated Colonel Roose?
velt's testimony that Mr. Harrlmaa
called up the White House ln October,
1904, and asked for an engagement to
see the President. "because the atate
sltuatlon ln New York was troubMng
them." He was uncertaln whether hfl
"happened" to be present at th? oonver
sa-tion or was called ln.
"Mr. Harriman startefl by saylng New
York was al! rlght as far as the Pr_si
dent was concerned," testlfled Mr. Loeb,
"but that a bolt had occurred agalnst
the state ticket and Higgins because t|
waa sald It waa an Odell ltlcket."
Mr. Harrlman, he added, asked thai
the national commlttee help Odell.
"Thfl President sald," continued Mi\
Loeb. " 'Mr. Harriman, I do not know
the condltlon of funds of the national
commlttee, but I should be eorry to
hav- Mr. Higgins beaten and I ahall aee
Mr. Cortelyou.' Then the President dlrect
ed me to telephone thls to Mr. Cortei.
you, whlch I did. Mr. Cortelyou aald he
would take the matter up wlth Mr. B,tag
and would be glad to see Mr. HarTtraan.'*
Mr. Loeb sald he knew nothlng of thfl
Harriman fund durlnjj tha campaign.
Taking up the Standard Oll contrlbu?
tion, h* sald that after two letters had
falied to ellclt a reply from Cortelyou as
to refuslng the contribution he suggested
telephonlng to Cortelyou. Thls falied to
secure a reply, ho sald, and he telephoned
to New York, gettlng Mr. Bllsa.
Mr. Bliss Waa Irntated.
"I told Mr. Bliss about the letters and
the telegram*," aald Mr. Loeb, "and th_t
the President wanted to know lf ttwe
was any Standard Oll contrlbution. Mr.
Bliss ahowed a llttle lrntatkin. I thought,
ln his manner, and sald:. 'You piay ?.?-il
the President that the spirit apd the. Ut?
ter of Mr. Cortelyou's announcenient _j
to corporation'contrlbution* wtll be car.
rled out, and that no contribution has
been or will be recelved from the Stand?
ard Oll Company.'
"After talking wlth Mr. Bliss I was told
Mr. Cortelyou had come ln. So I talked
wlth him. He said he had been busy and
Mr. Bllas had been out, and that was th*
reason of the delay ln the reply. Bfl s.-tld
that Mr. Bllsfl had told hlm no such -on*
trlbutlon had been or would be recelved,
and that, so far aa hla knowledge went,
no auch contribution had bfl?n or would
b? recelved."
Senator Clapp aaked IX the w:t;i_u
knew ar.y further facta of Interest to thfl
"Senator, you know that my l!p? havfl
been aealed aa to my confldentlal r?!_
tlona wlth Colonel Roosevelt. Only.thfl
gubposna of thls commlt'.e haa unseaUd
my Up*. But I want to *ay that it would
be as easy to yrove that tho moca IB
raade of green cheese as to fmpugn t_?
Integrlty of Colonfll Roosevelt as aff-ot*
Ing contrlbutlons of corporations or e_/
public or prlvate act"
He added that he knew co further f?o_l
relatlng to campaign fur.ds.
After trylng ln valn to have Mr. Lofl
admlt that he belleved the $100,000 contifc
butlon credlted to the Standard OIL Corn*
pany ln 1*04 had been recelved and hal
never b.-en returned, Senator lv:. *r*afl
concluded the examlnatlon.
Th? commlttee then adjaurned u__|
Monday at 10 o'clock.
Presents One of 1908 Barring
Corporation Gii'ts.
Washington, Oct. -_?Theodor. Rooflfl*
velt presented to the Senate commlttH
to-day a letter he had found ln hls flle*.
wrltten September a. 1908. to Oeorge R.
Sheldon, treasurer of the Republican >>'?**
tlonal Commlttee, regardlng corporatlos
jontrlbutlons. lt read;
My Dear Sheldon? I have been tntortnal
that you, or some one on Lehalf ot lat
national commlttee, haver reipiested ?0n
trlbutlons both from Mr. Archbold *n?
Mr. Harrlman. If thia IB true I wUftw
enter a most earnest prot**t and to s*J
that, ln my Judgment, not only fl-flg
such contrtbuUons r.utb* aollclted. J>ul
If tendered they should be refused. ?o
lf th~y hava been accepted they shouai
immedlately be returnel. .
1 am not tho candidate, but 1 ani im
tiead of tho Republican admlnlstratH*
whlch la an laaue ln thla cainpaigr., *??
[ protest most eatnestly agaln-t. bbbj
whom we are proserutltig belng ef***?
contrlbute to elect a President wll0??^
apjiolnt an attorney general to ooijuo""
these prosecutlons. ___*
Four ycurs ago Mr. Cortelyou ret'-rne*
as I am infowied. any money forwar
uy ar.y one who was b?l?* prosecutea
pioceeded agalnst. hy'th? nationa I__
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