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.'" tcr"-', (Extracts from an interview with the Holy Father, by Philip Gibbs.) At the doorway stood Benedict XV. He was a simple figure dressed in white, not so tall as 1 had expected, ~and with a scholar's look, a little aus tere at first glance. Only at a glance, for after my first salute, and when I asked him for permission to speak in French, he laughed in a genial way, and said in French also, "In that lan guage ,we shall understand each oth er." Then he took me by the hand and led me to a chair close to his own so that we sat side by side. He asked me about America, first, having heard that I had been there not long ago, and then asked me to tell him about the little studies I have been mak ing of the conditions of Europe after the war. I spoke to him about the distress of peopled burdened by high prices and heavy taxation, and about the curious and rather dangerous psychology of many people in Eng land, France, Belgium and Germany —probably in Italy also—who are in revolt against present conditions, and are disillusioned about that "new world" which they expected after the war. The People's Duty. The Holy Father listened attentive' ly, and then cut me short, as I had hoped. "Yes," he said, "the wfcr was a scourge"—he urged that word "fieaU" several times in his conversation— "and the effects of it are enormous and Incalculable. When it began peo ple imagined that it would be a quick ,wer—lasting three, four, or five months. Few guessed that it would last for*nearly five years. That long period of strifd^-that terrific' scourge will have far-reaching and'enduring results. "The people must make up their minds to endure the consequences of war. They must steel themselves to suffer. At the same time we must do everything in ohr power to alleviate those sufferings and to ease the bur dens of those who can least afford to support them." 44 I noticed that throughout our con A Large and Most Appreciative Audi ence Hears Recorder J. P. Murphy of Hibbing, Speak Upon Ireland's Cause and His Recent Trip to the "Old Land." A recent issue of the Mesaba Ore contains the following address of Mr. J. P. Murphy of Hibbing, lately a vis itor to the land of his birth. Mr. Murphy is one of the best known and respected citizens of that section of the state in which he lives, is a prom inent Episcopalian and his address and story of the trip will be read with Interest by every reader of the Irish Standard. He spoke as follows: "If one would ask me: 'What is the religious question in Ireland?' I would be compelled to answer, 'I don't know,'" said J. P. Murphy, village recorder, who has just returned from a visit to his old home in Ireland, speaking be fore the members of the Benjamin Franklin branch of the Friends of Irish Freedom and their friends in the public library last night. Hibbing tor the first time was given the opportun ity of hearing one of its own citizens, a man who has been respected by the people ftor many years, give his ver sion of the Irish struggle for inde pendence. They were given the op portunity of hearing from the lips of their own citizen, one that Is not a member of 'the Roman Catholic church, that the Irish question was not a religions question. Recorder Murphy In beginning hie address held up bis right hand and •aid: "Yon people have come here for the truth—God grant that I may tell itr "I am glmd to see so many people oat to the meeting tonight—it is grati fying and inspiring," said Mr. Murphy. 1 don't know whether you came to the meeting to hear what I have to say concerning the Irish cause, or came here out of respect to me, hut I am going to claim part of it, and the great saaee can claim the rest." The Holy Father on World's Unrest versation the Pope's thought* teemed to be concentrated mostly upon the conditions of the working classes. He spoke of the people, rather than of their rulers, and of the poor, rather than of the rich. When, for instance, I referred again to the strikes and other symptoms of social unrest in many countries, he said: "The people have been Irritated by a sense of injustice. There are many men who have made money out of this war." He made a gesture with his forefinger and thumb as though touching money, and said, "Those who grew rich out of the war will have to pay I" For a few minutes his mind went back to the great conflict .which had caused all this fiancial ruin in Eu rope, and he spoke of what the Catho lic Church had done, and tried to do, to alleviate its miseries and agonies. "We could do very little," he said, "in comparison with the enormous suffering caused by the war, but as far as possible we took every oppor tunity of relieving the sorrow of peo ple by work of charity. We could do no more than that, and it was only small compared with all the suffer ing but it did bring comfort to many poor- people, and mitigated some of the severities of military acts." His Holiness mentioned briefly some of the work which had been achieved under his direction, and re ferred me to a detailed list of charlt able services done during the war by the Holy See. Among these works .which Benedict XV particularly men tioned were the exchange of prison ers of war incapacitated for military service, following his telegram dated December 31, 1914, tc the sovereigns and heads of belligerent' States and the liberation and exchange of civilian prisoners. These proposals were accepted, and the exchange of prisoners through Switzerland proceeded quickly, so that between March, 1915, and November, 1916, 2,343 Germans and 8,868 French men returned to their own countries, while in a single month 20,000 French (Continued on page 4) He stated that he kept a few notes of his trip mid was going to give the audience JuW the facts and impres sions obtained while in Ireland. He advised the audience that if any one was thinking of making the trip to Ireland at the present time to tell them not to go. He told of his trials and tribulations in obtaining pass ports, and that a passport was nothing more than a nuisance. He stated that while in Duluth he was told by a friend that he need not .worry but that the British government would know all about him before he arrived in Ireland. He told of his feeling when he landed in the United States on his return and said that it was worth while making the trip to enjoy the pleasure of get ting back. "I was surprised to find, while in Ireland, that the British soldiery was everywhere, and that the streets and even the trains were filled with sol diers—that even the little villages and hamlets had their garrisons of sol diers," said the recorder. "It is es timated that there is between fifty thousand and one hundred and fifty thousand British soldiers in Ireland. These, with the Royal Irish Constabu lary, bring the total armed forces in Ireland to about 225,000 men." He stated that Ireland was gov erned by "Dora," as the Irish call it, but which in reality means the De fense of the Realm Act, and which means that all governing and execu tive power has been placed with the military. "Under that system the Irish young men are being tried and condemned in private, and sent to prison," stated Mr. Murphy. "It's a common occur rence to see a young Irish lad being taken to jail between two soldiers, and to hear him shout at the top of his voice: Up with thf republic!' Oh, yes, the vast majority of the people of Ireland ase in favor of the —especially those of the yonnger oration." -V" -I Vol. XXXV. No. 10 Minneapolis, Minn., Saturday, January 10, 1920 republic -$3L- Article X, Which the Irish Race At tacked as Upholding English Domin ion, Admittedly Caused Downfall. (By C. P. A.) Washington, Jan. 6. Although there is no rift of light on the sena torial horizon, Washington looks for ward to the ratification of the Peace Treaty some time in January. Such, at least, is a common prediction, but it is purely a prediction, and has no basis in fact. The original treaty as the President brought it is doomed. Strangely, enough, with this situa- tion prevailing in Washington, the Lloyd George home rule plan has not evoked ft ripple of comment. The op^country position to Section 10 has not been modified in the slightest degree and the Irish national movement goes on quite the same as before. It is evident that, if the British Government counted upon its home rule plan for ally criticism in the United States there has been no responsive echo in the capital. Friends of Ireland Mass Meeting. On the contrary, preparations have? been made for a mass meeting to be "I confess, like the majority of you, that I believed the Easter rebellion in Ireland was foolhardy, but now I know that it was not," said Murphy. "The Irish people learned that writing and speaking got them nowhere and that it was the auspicious time for them to do something that would once more bring the Irish' cause to the ears of the world they wanted to show that Ireland was not content to remain a subject nation. They knew that per haps they would be compelled to lay do,wn their lives for the cause, but they knew that by making such a sac rifice the Irish question would once more be brought to the attention of the world. The rebellion did that very thing. The Irish laid down their lives and the que'stion is once more con fronting the civilized world, and near ing solution." He said that the Irish know that they must obtain aid from without be fore the question can be settled satis factorily, and that is the reason why they are asking aid in the United States. He told of an argument that he had with a man who had traveled through Ireland at one time. The man said that the Irish in the southern portion were thriftless. He said that such a statement was an untruth, the Irish in the southern portion of the country are not thriftless. He told of how the landlords took all that the little Irish farmer raised in taxes and rentals, of how the Irish farmer could not repair his fence and houses, because of the lack of funds, and why he was unable to obtain new clothes occasionally. He stated that if an Irish fanner would appear before bis landlord with a new suit of clothes, the landlord would raise the rental that much more. He stated, however, that the land bill had alleviated the conditions of the Irish termers. He said that he was a south ern Irishman, and that he wasn't afraid of comparison with the Northern Irishman or ^pj other race for that _, ^"v *V^'^i'J' -i.-~ -V Original Treaty Seems Doomed Section Main Obstacle. Section 10 of the League of Nations Covenant, the particular target of at tack for those who are pleading the cause of Ireland, continues to be the main obstacle in the way of an agree ment. Outside of the reference to the Shantung agreement the other reser vations in the so-called Lodge resolu tion of ratification might be adjusted to the satisfaction of both sides, but neither has shown any signs of yield ing on Section 10. The President, ac cording to all accounts, regards it as iel F. Quigley, Thomas Petit, George essential, especially the phrase guar-! A. Hernan, Francis T. Hurley, Robert anteeing the territorial integrity of?Barrett, Mrs. Quinlan, Mrs. George Fe- member nations. The Senate regardB it as unacceptable. From this it may be assumed that' the Irish question is of a momentous character in more ways than one. It has become the center of the fight over the League of Nations, upon which che peace of the world, accord ing to the league adherents, in large measure depends. ,. nine hundred members, has taken up Lloyd George Home Rule Ignored... .. .. the matter in earnest, and is preparing an held shortly after the new year iB ush ered in for the reception of Eamonn de Valera, provisional "President of the Irish Republic." President de Valera haB visited Washington several times, on some occasions slipping in and out quietly without making his presence known but he has not yet made a public appearance. The forth coming mass meeting, therefore, may be regarded more or less as a national affair. The local branch of the Friends of Irish Freedom has made arrangements to secure the largest hall in the city, anticipating an enormous crowd to hear the spokesman of Ireland's cause. The following committee on arrange ments has been appointed: Arrangements Committee. P. T. Moran, William Needham, Rossa F. Downing, Jeremiah O'Conner, P. J. Ryan, Joseph A. Daly, Miss Mar garet Butler, Miss Margaret Brosna han, John J. Noonan, George Rorke, J. Frank O'Meara, Tom McGratli, Dan- gan, Miss Katherine Breen, Rev. John J. Callahan, Dr. P. J. Healy and John Trant. K. C. Headquarters to Washington? The movement to bring the head quarters of the Knights of ColumbuB to Washington has been revived by the Washington councils. Potomac •Council, which boasts of more than organized campaign. The argument is made that the capital is the logical center from which all parts of the IRISH QUESTION NOT SECT QUESTION" may be reached aad lliat here the organization will be directly In touch with national affairs. William J. Feely, Grand Knight, has announced that a committee will be appointed to direct the movement for the' transfer of the headquarters. Literature will be distributed and an effort will be made to secure sufficient backing for the project by the time the next na tional convention meets. matter, and he didn't think that the others in this country would be afraid to compare themselves with the north ern Irishman. "Ireland's resources will support a population of twice the present num ber," said Mr. Murphy. "Beside the rich farming lands of the country, there are 'coal, copper and marble fields which are still undeveloped. They will not be developed until Ire land has a republic, because, at pres ent, they know that it would be Im possible to compete .with England. "The English at the present time have two policies in Ireland," re marked Mr. Murpliy, "one is that of suppression and the other policy is what we in America call 'soft soap.' The suppression is applied by a mili tary, stiffles the press and free speech, and governs, or rather tries to govern Ireland, with the mailed fist. The 'soft soap' policy comes in the form of unlimited rations, which even the English at home do not enjoy, and other pseudo good works. But the Irish people are not fooled, they know the ways of England from past asso ciations. They know that England has no charity for Ireland," he said. Another English "bug-bear" he stated, was that If Ireland was made a free nation, England would have an enemy at her very door. He said that this statement, too, was an untruth, as everyone acquainted with the nature of the Irishmen knows that one act of kindness will cause him to forgive all the injuries of the past, and that Ire land collectively Is like Ireland in dividually. "No," he said, "Ireland will not be an enemy of England, If her freedom is granted, and so soon as that day comes, amicable relations between the two countries will spring np, and the past will be forgotten." Another English argument against Irish freedom was that if Ireland was given her freedom the other British Society Capito1 nnesota ^cun HISTORICAL Brilliant and Convincing Expression of Views on English Premier's Latest Attempt to Cloud the Issue—Judge Cohalan Knocks to Pieces the Amer ican Analogy—Ireland as a Nation Never Accepted the Idea of British Domination. When Justice Cohalan of New York, was asked for an expression of his opinion upon Lloyd George's scheme for giving Ireland its freedom, etc., the justice said: "This is only another attempt upon the part of the responsible spokesman for the classes .who rule England to becloud the issue and to attempt to turn the public opinion of the world in to a channel'that will be favorable to them. There is only one issue be tween England and Ireland and that, in its last analysis, is a very simple one. There are two peoples who want to govern and to control Ireland—the Irish people to whom it belongs and for whom it was set apart by God him self, and the English people to whom it does not belong, and who through their ruling classes have been endeav oring to get possession of it for provinces would likewise ask for free dom and self-determination, and he said, "If England must deny one coun try its freedom because others will also make the same demand, England has no right to hold these colonies," Perhaps the most interesting phase of Recorder Murphy's lecture was the religious question. Because of the difference in religion of the Irish peo ple, England claims that Ireland could not govern itself without continued dissension. Heretofore, all the speak ers had been Roman Catholics, who are in the vast majority in Ireland, but Mr. Murphy is of a different creed. For the first time, the people had the opportunity of hearing a plea for In* dependence for Ireland from one of a Protestant religion, and from a creed, the English claimed did not want in dependence. "If one was to ask me 'What is the religious question in Ireland?' I would be compelled to answer: 'I don't know,' remarked the recorder. "Per haps there has been disturbances In Ulster, but I am sure that Protestants there .were the aggressors, not because of religion, but at the instigation of the British government" "The English Bay The Mental Twists of Lloyd George 750 years. That they have utterly failed to do that except to the extent to which a naked rule of force enables them to hold Ireland with a great army of occupation is proved by Lloyd George's statement that "never was British rule so unpopular in Ireland as it is today.' The people of Ireland want possession of their own country to rule it for themselves .with absolute political and religious equality for all the people of that land and without hostility or animosity to any other people. They did on December 14 last declare just what they wanted. With a plebiscite taken on that day in spite of the presence of a great army of oc cupation and of the existence of mar tial law, in spite of the arrest and re moval of many of their leaders, in spite of the suppression of the right of assembly and of free speech, they declared by a vote of over 1,200,000 to 308,000 in favor of the establishment of an independent republic and of the total separation of Ireland from Eng land. that if Ireland was given its freedom, the Protestants in Ireland would suffer, but *he people of Ireland know*that such would not be the case, and that is the reason, proportionally, that the Protestants are also fighting and dying for Inde pendence. In the little village, where I was born and raised there are twenty Roman Catholics to every Protestant, and because of that I have more Cath olic friends than Protestant friends. To my own knowledge there has never been any ill feeling between the peo ple of the two creeds," he stated. He told of how on his arrival In his home town, he .was kissed by two women, one his mother, who Is a Protestant, and the other an old friend of the family, who is a Soman Catho mr "Lloyd George speaking for the rul ing class which he represents said that the secession of Ireland from the em pire would be opposed with the same, vigor and determination with which the North opposed secession of the Southern States. This iB simply another clever mental ruse of the mm who hap been well called the artful dodger of British politics. There is absolutely no analogy between th» cases. The Southern States were by choice and from the beginning an in tegral part of the United States. Their representatives took part in the estab lishment of the United States and helped to formulate the constitution and to create the institutions under which we live. They then wanted to leave the Union which they had helped to create and very properly, were not permitted to do so. The people of Ire land never voluntarily entered the British Empire. When the Act of the Union went into effect on January 1, 1801, it did so as the result of what Gladstone, the great English Liberal Premier, characterized as the worst piece of corruption and jobbery to he found in the annals of history. It was brought about under the direction of Pitt by the work of the infamous Lord Castlereagh, and who as Byron said: 'Having cut his country's throat, fit tingly cut his own.' The Parliament which he corrupted and which was elected only to administer the affaire of the country, was made up of repre sentatives of only 10 per cent of the people of Ireland. It had no power to delegate its authority to any body, much less to destroy the liberties of its country and vote itself out of exis tence. But this is only one of the mental twists of Lloyd George. Ha is an adept like his long list of British statesmen predecessors, In giving a name to a thing which it does not In any .way deserve. He affects to give to Ireland in one phrase general pow ers of government which he then, by speciilc qualifications takes away In the next breath. "By a talk of two parliaments for a country which neither nature nor its people have divided, he tries to con- (Continued on ttmge 4) lic. He told of how his mother wis held up, as he was leaving, by two women, one a Roman Catholic and the other a Protestant. He told of how he, when a boy, bad played around the Roman Catholic church' door, and that the old canon was one of the best friends of the family. "Perhaps, these little incidentals don't mean much to you, but they do to me—they show that the Catholics and Protestants do get along together in Ireland, and will get along under the republic," he explained. "If the nations, of which the major ity of people have heard very little^ have been conceded the right of sel*» determination, why not give Ireland tbat right?" he questioned. "I am proud of my American citizen ship, but I cannot forget the land In which I was raised, and look forward to the day when Ireland will take her rightful place among the nations of the world," he stated In ending. Following the ending of his address, the hall rang with applause. Con Kepple, president of the Ben jamin Franklin branch of the Friends of Irish Freedom, acted as chairman of the meeting. Mr. Kepple stated that they WBfie nearing the goal. He told of the Ms son bill, calling for an appropriation of $14,000 to pay the expenses of minister and consuls to the new re public and which virtually meant rQt* ognition of the republic. He refuted the claim that Ireland was on the side of Germany in thh war, when he pointed out that fifty eight per cent of the Irish people of military age enlisted voluntarily on the side of the allies. President Kepple announced that An January 21, Colonel William H. DohJ* hue of Minneapolis, an officer in UBS Rainbow division, would address th Friends of Irish Freedom here. Ob January 21, the first anniversary dt the Irish republic will be celebrated. r.^ &